Phone apps are nothing more than modern toolbars. And in case you forgot or missed this phase of the internet…
Click to win a FREE LOBSTER Dinner 🦀🦞🦐
Man I miss this era of the internet. It truly felt like a new frontier.
I clicked, but all I got was a dancing stripper and something called Conficker.
Peak internet wdym
No argument there, especially with Bonzi Buddy lol
I want a re-made Bonzi buddy with AI.
I don’t vouch for these, as I have not used them. But, I found this rewritten one and this one with LLM.
“2020 search”
Bruh someone’s grandma needs help, we need to fix this computer, it looks like it’s about to get stuck on zombo.com.
I remember toolbar days… I used to lov— sorry i admit this … Installing them … shivers for my sins
needs more sheep
Yeah, Bonzi Buddy!
Could you expand on that thought a bit more? How is an app like the internet tool bars of old?
Genuinely curious. I’m a little too young to have experienced internet toolbars like the ones in your image.
Every service and site had their own malicious toolbar they’d ask you to install and / or* sneak it into the install for other software. They also came loaded with malware and or siphoned data from you. Older/more tech illiterate people would have browsers looking like the picture above and come to you wondering why their computer is so slow or why they keep getting viruses.
Plus the even simpler: apps are like browser “toolbars” because they’re just a veneer to collect more data, add more tracking, appear to be useful without actually benefitting the user over a simple web page
Ohh, I see. That makes a lot of sense. I understand the comparison now, ty 🙏
@alekwithak @techforwhat Norton Antivirus is still at it
Hooboy
I missed that phase because I was using Netscape.
Then you didn’t miss it. You glossed over it, like a boss
Then you could agree with any barely computer-savvy person that such things should be killed with fire.
Now a lot of very competent person will try to persuade you how you are a luddite and wrong, except 5-10 years ago they’d also promise some bright tech future in addition to that, and now you’re just wrong because they can exist in that environment and like it, and you can’t.
you can’t.
Can, but refuse. Big distinction for me. I’ve lived through these arguments once already, and have watched their computers keel over and die several time from the viruses these toolbars often bring, and I will now watch as their phones do the same.
No Virtua Girl?
THIS IS ACTUALLY SO REAL FUCKING SMARTPHONES I HATE STEVE JOBS FUCK YOU WHY DID YOU RUIN TECHNOLOGY.
ok rant over, but seriously though, it’s so fucked how you basically just need a smartphone to do ANYTHING these days. I don’t want a phone, i have no use for one.
I for one cheer and root for my flip phone friends.
I’d never do it, but we have one at work and he’s singlehandedly causing so much grief at work. Because none of the engineers wanna use a security app for login. They want a fob.
IT refuses to pay for fobs and wants us to use an app, but they also don’t want to pay for a phone for anyone in engineering just to use the security app because it opens a floodgate of people with company phones.
It’s just wonderful to watch this fight from the sidelines sipping tea.
I have no smartphone and am unable to access any of my college resources or email from home because you need a security app for remote login. I’ve got in trouble a few times for it but idk what I’m supposed to do. I wasn’t able to access my Exam Timetable because of this and had to ask some friends when the exams were because my teachers didn’t know (somehow). It’s very annoying.
Edit:
It also took a few weeks of difficulty to get the free bus pass the college gives out as they only gave it out on the bus pass app, I have a card that you scan, I’ve never had any issues with the card and yet EVERY day people complain about the app not working as you need an internet connection (in an area with dodgy internet) for the app and the app is apparently not very good in other areas. I think people are starting to get jealous of my bus pass card.
You could install an android emulator on your personal computer then run the authenticator from there.
The OC said in a different comment that you must be on the college network to set it up.
You don’t need to tag me, by the way; I get a notification if someone responds to me directly.
sorry, I’m viewing this from mastodon so the setup’s different.
All good. Hope you have a great day!
Yes, it’s a specific one. App only.
The authenticator requires you to be in the college’s network to set it up for the first time and I don’t have a laptop.
Ah, that does complicate matters. Good luck.
BRB pulling up to a QR code scanner with my 15 inch thinkpad w520 running on 92whr of battery consuming literal watts of power because it’s from 2012.
Hopefully i’m not an inconvenience.
I’d never do it, but we have one at work and he’s singlehandedly causing so much grief at work.
tell him the funny internet man that replied to you told him that he was based and that we collectively appreciate his efforts of basedness.
what’s the rationale for IT not wanting to pay for the fobs?
Presumably they’re expensive and someone needs to manage them.
My company’s approach is “we’ll pay your phone bill if you use an Authenticator app on your phone.” Cheaper for them, plus they don’t need to buy company phones or fobs, and who’s going to complain about their phone bill getting paid?
A previous company tried similar but required putting your phone under enterprise management. A lot of us disagreed with that
They’re not expensive at all.
Well, my old company sure made a ridiculous profit selling them. You may be looking at the cost per fob hardware, but not including the management cost. They are much more expensive than an authentication app, plus authentication apps are mostly managed by someone else, and you don’t have distribution overhead
what exactly is the management cost here?
at my old company they simply ordered a yubikey for you amd forgot about it. nobody kept track of it. i didn’t even need to return mine when i was leaving. the part they manage is the user account. the hardware you get once and use for added security…
This may be relevant
In my experience, the only thing that really made them more difficult than managing end users who were using an authentication app instead was having to facilitate getting the fob to the users and replacing them occasionally and they were dirt cheap… Like less than $5 apiece.
Managers probably sold apps as a cost cutting measure
My job does this too. It’s literally just cost cutting. The fobs expire and need to be replaced every so often but the app lasts “forever”.
IMO the fobs pay for themselves because what they are spending on fobs is the same as what they’re spending on IT members answering calls all day for employees that are having login issues with the app.
I worked a job where I had to have an app that tracked me wherever I went. I finally had to tell my boss I couldn’t use it anymore because it was killing my battery in like 3 hours.
If I was still working and a job wanted me to put an app on my personal phone I’d tell them to go fuck themselves.
Just another way capitalists thieve money from its workers.
I for one cheer and root for my flip phone friends.
Why are you cheering for a lack of self-control?
Smartphones are great. You just need to be smart enough to not let them use you.
It should put into perspective who is a useful idiot, and who is not.
Perhaps his friends do not have smart phones, because they do not want smart phones.
Yes, but why don’t they want smartphones?
Any time I’m required to use an app for something that could be a website, I leave the app a one star review.
everyone wants to force you to use apps instead of websites, despite the fact that the overwhelming majority of apps are just websites…in a app wrapper, because normal websites and normal browsers have inbuilt protections for you.
Apps don’t.
Idiots install apps, give them the 400,000 permissions they ask for, then go on their merry way…ignorant to the fact that they just installed a data vacuum on their phone thats siphoning everything off of it to be used and sold and resold for marketing purposes… Even the phone itself its not safe, cause its sitting there, listening to your conversations, even when not on a call, to more “Accurately” spam you with bullshit.
because normal websites and normal browsers have inbuilt protections for you.
Ding ding ding.
Yep, 100%. That digital coupon is you getting paid $0.33 for the data they collected from you.
This is why I install such shit only if i have to, and only on vm
Phones are not listening and if you have proof post it. No security researcher has ever posted this.
[https://youtu.be/0dGqR4ue8dg](Idk i trust Snowden’s take on this over yours)
See:
- MindShift
- Cox Media Group (Alternative non-subscriberwalled link here)
yeah yeah, people said the same thing about google home and amazon alexa for years… until data leaks proved that was a lie, too.
It’s called “Active Listening”
https://www.404media.co/heres-the-pitch-deck-for-active-listening-ad-targeting/
There should be a warning label on any establishment or product that requires a smartphone to use.
How about this:
At the apartments I recently moved out of, there were no quarter slots on the washing machines. They were an app that required a bluetooth connection to pay.
So if you lived there and didn’t have a smartphone? Go fuck yourself, you don’t get to do laundry.
Unless you bothered to check the laundry room when you were looking at the apartment, you wouldn’t know. No warnings.
That…
Is that not illegal where you live?
America has next to no protections for tenants, only landlords.
It’s not even required that apartment buildings have laundry services at all. There are commercial storefront laundromats in the US which serve as the ground floor for where people do their laundry. Until landlords are required to provide laundry, it will be hard to legislate what payment forms they must accept.
Tbf, my building also uses an app for laundry. However they also have a machine in the laundry rooms where you can purchase an NFC payment card and put money on it. So you can use it without the app. Is that not the case with yours? If not, that’s 100% fucked
quarter slots on the washing machines
Thank god they decided to keep these free where I live
I understand its probably the norm where you are but why aren’t they just free to use? You pay rent…
That depends a bit on if it was advertised or not to have a laundry room. At least here in NL it is more common to have your own washing machine than to use a shared one so having a laundry room would be an extra to start with.
Still sucks though
The more insane thing here for me is the fact that there isn’t a washing machine inside your apartment.
(btw lived in such once, apparently the owner wasn’t very wealthy. We washed everything by hand)
It’s actually incredibly common in US apartments for laundry to be a common area.
Having a unit in your apartment means you’re at least well-to-do. Poor people can mostly go fuck themselves.
Well-to-do? That is weird, because here not having a washing machine in the apartment would be weird even for a poor person.
US hates poor people. I’m poor, I know from experience. They hold homelessness over us as a threat to keep in line.
We went from during the pandemic, treating “essential workers” as “heroes” while not increasing their pay for risking their lives, to now, straight back to how it used to be, screaming at overworked underpaid people “You’re lucky to have a job!” as they break our bodies and then discard us once our bodies are broken. I know caregivers who have broken backs because they have to lift 350lb people without the proper equipment and they don’t get paid enough to afford to live in an apartment alone.
The number of people trapped in outright dangerous relationships just to afford a place to live is too damn high. It’s a massive human rights issue, and the US will never address it under current leadership. They treat poverty as something that happens to bad people. They believe that their wealth proves that they are good people. They are myopic fools.
They fucking hate us. Anything to make us feel low, they will do.
Where I am, the median salary is around $400-$500. I know how you feel.
You’ve never seen The Big Bang Theory?
No I have not, heard it is offensive and unfunny.
Well, I was merely asking because I know about shared laundry rooms being a thing in US because of that show.
There was a food truck I went to one time that required you to download some app to look at their menu and order your food. They refused to accept a credit card or cash. I walked. So fucking stupid. I don’t know why people allow shit like that to exist.
As I’ve been making an effort to replace apps with the browser version of the service. It’s so abundantly clear that companies don’t want you using their website.
Even if they don’t outright cripple functionality, they’ll hound you endlessly to install the app.
It’s infuriating to say the least.
Even if they don’t outright cripple functionality, they’ll hound you endlessly to install the app.
Still don’t understand the logic of doing that.
It’s like saying,
“Our website is nigh unusable, please install our app instead. We pinky promise our app works”.
It’s because you have control over your browser, but they control their app and all its trackers, ads, etc
Yep. They want you to use apps, cause all the permissions you give the app makes it much easier for them to harvest all your data for marketing and selling purposes.
That’s exactly it. Easy to block ads and trackers on a website, but more difficult or impossible on some apps.
One of the banking apps won’t show the total balance of the account unless I’m using the app. How ridiculous.
They know that a lot of people would rather have it work a little better by getting an app, if they keep reminding people it’s an option.
Even if “better” is just lack of nags.
It’s sad. We need a digital privacy law so that an app can’t be more invasive than the website.
Even if “better” is just lack of nags.
Well, they just swap nags from “download our app” to “rate our app” no matter what you do, you’ll be nagged…
I’m young and I fucking hate apps. I have android phone without a google account which works well for the most part. I’m too dumb to install LineageOS. and Linux phones aren’t really an option in the US.
These useless apps make Linux phone adoption harder, fuck them!
I still miss firefox os and feel sad for them not succeeding. Their app system could have become a multiplatform standard and allow us to have much more options in the smartphone market, as well as better desktop integration and interoperability :(
that is your takeaway? You’re part of a cult if that’s really how you think.
Part of a cult for wanting more options…
Ill be part of that cult
Not more options, you want your option to win.
And? Apple and Google are too big and influential as they’re. Why go attacking the little guys?
Linux is awesome, what are you crying about?
You’re an idiot or you’re trolling, I honestly can’t tell.
I’m never trolling about Linux. On Lemmy there are so many cultists that you can say the most innocuous things and it will be downvoted to oblivion or deleted for “trolling”. Maybe you don’t like calling it a cult but I get more downvoted for negative comments about Linux than other people do when they literally say Nazi things.
And then you get people like this…I mean what kind of broken prejudiced brain do you have to have to think this comparison is ok?
“You’re a cultist!” screamed the cultist, angry at people for using something other than what the cultist prefers.
innocuous
Calling people “cultists” doesn’t sound very “innocuous”.
What does that even mean?
Most people here would be satisfied with a working website they can access from any browser or OS, mobile or desktop.
Because a Linux phone is objectively superior, duh
We want other options to be allowed to exist. This is “you just want everyone to be gay/trans/whatever” all over again.
Oof you’re comparing government suppression of entire classes of people to linux’ failure to attract developers to the platform… How do you not realize you’re in a cult???
Plenty of developers use Linux every day – the problem is it’s not a viable choice for users because of anti - competitive practices by Google and Apple and probably others
I use GraphineOS on my Pixel 7 and even I feel penalized for caring about my privacy. Its absolutely nonsense, not everything needs an app.
Yeah. My bank is one of the few UK banks whose app won’t work with Graphene, which is irritating. Also, the lack of Wallet access for payment cards is annoying.
But all in all everything else works fine.
Lloyds? they’re closing my local branch as well really need to go in and close the accounts tbh.
Yep, Lloyds.
They were absolute bellends when I tried to get it sorted to transfer the money to another bank as well, sat there insisting my “phone had been hacked/had a virus” and only actually moved my bloody money after I threatened a official complaint.
It’s true in many ways. If I buy McDonald’s without the app I pay more for it. If I fill up my gas tank without an app like upside, I pay more for it. There are services that aren’t even available to people without modern phones (I refuse to call them smart phones). Maybe we need legislation to ensure all available discounts, services and benefits are available to customers equally regardless of how they engage services.
I wouldn’t mind these apps if there was actually a technical need for them beyond just being a Chromium component, but with added data slurping and pointless notifications.
If I have to use an app to use your product/store, I won’t use your product/store, with a side helping of go fuck yourself on top.
also those who dont want to install that spyware shit on their phones. Even if you dont care about the data collection it still consumes battery faster as more and more data is being transferred
McDonald’s (in Germany at least) needs your location to “see when you arrive at the restaurant”. What the hell?! That doesn’t even work properly and they force it on me! I uninstalled the app and now I am actually happy, because without the promotion and discount stuff, I don’t eat McDanks that often anymore.
I use an app for OTR (petrol chain in Aus) and they’ve removed the requirement for location which is… Unexpected, to say the least. Anything except using the pumps on the app no longer needs it when all orders previously needed it.
Thats actually pretty nice. And on the subject of cars: I don’t get why (some) people with E-Cars say they are so much “greener” and then use like 10 different apps for the car, recharging, etc. Those servers produce so much, really, so god damn much CO2… (Not saying combustion engines are better, but…)
My Kia Sportage PHEV came with a “Kia Connect” app. There is a monthly charge but I get first 3 years for free. It’s got some sort of useful things but I don’t really use it much anymore. More likely than not I won’t bother to pay for it when the free years are up.
Understandable. In Germany it isn’t customary to have an AC, but I got one. It’s from Mitsubishi and has some cloud remote control app thing. I mean, ok, controlling the temperature from not home is maybe useful, but I haven’t and will never use it. I just set the Temperature and go on Auto mode…
McDonald’s wants your IQ too. Seriously, it’s in their privacy policy.
Hello McDonalds. My IQ is 500, so do I get like, free stuff or something?
Ok, that is crazy.
Yeah, I couldn’t be arsed to install that shit. I’m also not taking out my phone for this kind of bullshit. I’m sick and tired of smartphones.
I literally had to switch bank accounts because I couldn’t reset my password “on the web” and required me to use Virgin Money’s app.
Customer service agent(s) on the phone after prolonged discussions why their app wouldn’t work on three Android phones right in front of me surfaced, and I shit you not
Well sir, I have my iPhone here and can login just fine maybe you should buy one of those instead
That day I found out about this
have you tried stop being poor?!
Begin by just getting a house already.
So am so tired of people crying about it.
JFC just ask mom and dad for the down payment… Can’t you holdna a steady job?!
Maybe I could try buying and scalping an iPhone on eBay
:thinky face:
Kids these days just don’t want to work
See that’s the thing, I work far too hard and after a night shift and then getting onto a “customer support” agent reveals the cracks in our society.
Maybe you could work harder too!
Everyone I know works pretty hard and is underpaid but the teeveeue keeps saying nobody wants to work.
Deep inside I know the teevee never lies 🤡
It was the sheer arrogance of that “supervisor” I escalated it to and I hate to think how someone like a pensioner would’ve dealt with them that day wanting to access their bank account, especially since all the local branches have been closed 👺
RIP Yorkshire Bank
I also had to switch accounts because after an update, the banking app didn’t work any longer on my rooted phone and I couldn’t log in. Thankfully, I’ve been keeping two accounts since forever, with the main motivation being that banks really like changing their TOS and introducing all sorts of fees, which I don’t want.
Dude that comment would make my blood boil, like holy shit.
Everything by Virgin is shit. I don’t understand why they’re so big
Your switch is guaranteed
The Current Account Switch Service makes switching your current account simple, reliable and stress-free. You could even switch with an overdraft, just speak to your new bank first.
Over 11 million current accounts have been switched so far and over 50 banks and building societies are already part of the service.
The Account Switch Service Guarantee means your new bank will switch your payments and transfer your balance, and your old bank will take care of closing your old account. So you don’t need to worry.
I flat-out refuse to do business with any that requires I use an app. I won’t even scan a QR code for a restaurant menu; that’s my cue to go eat elsewhere.
I don’t mind the whole online menu thing. It’s probably an environmental net positive, but it’s bs if they don’t have ANY physical copies for those who can’t or don’t want to for whatever reason.
If they wanted me to install something, though, that’d be a 100% instant nope.
I mean I simply refuse to as QR code phishing is a thing
You might enjoy SecScannerQR then. It makes it easier to vet QR codes by giving an option to search for the URL instead of going there directly.
Isn’t that standard behavior though? I’ve never seen anything that opens a URL directly instead of just showing it to you with an option to access it.
Ooh. Now do iOS.
No, you stop doing iOS.
Ew
I mean you just need to audit the URL before going there.
An online menu requires power to be used (on people’s phones and the server). Is that really a minor contribution in comparison to printing paper and maybe laminating it?
Considering your average printer is a piece of shit that needs to be replaced quite often, yes, using a website is probably more energy efficient.
Most companies will be using laser printers, some of which may outlive me. Toner is cheap and lasts an age.
Inkjet printers are cheap for a reason. They’re a scam.
That and those servers are going to be running anyway. Powering a simple restaurant website is a grain of sand on the beach of internet usage.
Yeah, exactly. If you’re worried about the power draw to host a few hundred KB PDF file, you probably shouldn’t be using Lemmy, because scrolling through your feed probably uses 100x that in energy costs.
You have to remember that the shared hosting or aws, or wherever is going to be cheapest to host a simple website is also going to be very power efficient. Wasting power is just throwing away free money, and if there’s one thing corporations don’t do, it’s throw away free money.
Generally companies use service contracts to keep those things working so mo they wouldn’t be replaced often. They are just a piece of shit
This person has never seen the power bill for running a high-availability server with several failovers once in their lives.
In fairness neither have I - though I suspect it’s not as insignificant as others have claimed.
It’s not insignificant at all. Servers are beefy and take more power than a standard PC… a lot more. Further, failover servers mean you have to have exact copies of the same server up and available, which means you’re doubling, tripling, quadrupling power demands. Finally, you also have to have Uninterruptible Power Supplies, those take an amount of power as well.
It’s a huge power draw. I know because I have a bunch of low-power devices runnig 24/7 as microservices and it still increase my power bill and use by a lot. I regularly get letters from the power company about how I’m using like 3x the power of the average person in my type of unit.
I regularly get letters from the power company about how I’m using like 3x the power of the average person in my type of unit.
I’m also using a lot of self hosted things but have never received any of those.
Where do you reside generally where they’re sending them because it ain’t a thing here in the UK?
-
You can host a webserver on a Raspberry Pi. I don’t know what you’re doing with your setup but you absolutely do not need hundreds of watts to serve a few hundred KB worth of static webpage or PDF file. This website is powered by a 30 watt solar panel attached to a car battery on some guy’s apartment balcony. As of writing its at 71% charge.
-
An Ampere Altra Max CPU has 128 ARM cores (the same architecture that a raspberry pi uses), with a 250 watt max TDP. That works out to about 2 watts per core. Each of those cores is more than enough to serve a little static webpage on its own, but in reality since a lot of these sites get less than 200 hits per day the power cost can be amortized over thousands of them, and the individual cores can go to sleep if there’s still not enough work to do. Go ahead and multiply that number by 4 for failover if you want, its still not a lot. (Not that the restaurant knows or cares about any of this, all this would be decided by a team of people at a massive IT company that the restaurant bought webpage hosting from).
-
I had not considered that an uninterruptible power supply would be consuming power after charging. I suppose no electronics are 100% efficient at what they do.
I’ve been playing with a Proxmox server on an ITX system for local services and rare game hosting for friends. I’d love something low power I could have on all the time.
Scan QR code. Order on your phone. Pay on your phone. Asks for a tip.
So uh, what exactly am I tipping you here for dawg?
that stuff is nice as an option. There’s a bar I go to that I can order my food and drink to the table my friends are at, while I’m walking to the place, and everything just arrives shortly after I sit down. Other people get offended about how fast I get served, it’s always amusing. I also enjoy not interacting with the staff, nothing against them, brain just doesn’t brain sometimes.
But what if I didn’t have a phone? or if I left home without it? 24/7 pocket rectangle is not natural.
Losing your phone now is like losing not just your wallet but simple access to everything.
Can confirm. Brother had his phone stuck in LA for 2 weeks.
- Hard time signing into some sites as they only had text for 2 factor
- Modern alarm clocks are awful, you only get two options and must be plugged in, so if you want 3 alarms while you’re outside of your house? Fuck you.
- Harder to track public bus routes as not only can you not call dispatch, you can’t check with the app.
There’s probably more but those affected him the most. Genuinely weird that in 2025 alarm clocks are stuck in 1985.
The funny thing about qr codes for restaurant menus to me, as someone that studied menu design. Is that actual menus are designed specific ways make the restaurant more profit and make it easier for people to find what they want. Whereas qr codes often bring one to a hastily designed list of categories which are not only less intuitive but also less manipulative. So people will end up taking longer to order less profitable dishes.
I’ve been to some that try to upsell you during the checkout process. Big pop up comes up “Add x to your order for $y.99!” Shut the fuck up!
One of these seems to be one of the best ways to order pizza from Papa John’s.
They usually have a special for a Large Pizza for pickup, and at the checkout, you can ignore the add-ons and choose “make it extra large” and it’s the best deal I’ve seen for papa johns XL pizza.
Hell yeah, consumer win. I like selecting an item and it offers me changes or addition options that I never would have considered!
But really, it means they can hire less people so they gain profit anyway.
Worst thing about qr menus for me is that when I finally order, I have to give my phone number and address. Bro, I’m sitting across from the kitchen and just want dumplings. Why I gotta dox myself for that?
Dennis Takes a Mental Health Day is probably the most accurate portrayal of me ever written.
