• Potfarmer@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      65
      arrow-down
      4
      ·
      1 year ago

      Next year will mark my 16th year voting for democrats, all they do is kick the can and move the line. While I don’t think there is anything wrong with saying don’t vote conservative, I do think it’s a bit like saying “CLOSE YOUR WINDOWS” when a tornado is coming. We’re screwed regardless of who we vote for, the only thing that changes is the rate at which we’re screwed; that is why Anon is sick of life.

      • 0ddysseus@infosec.pub
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        38
        arrow-down
        5
        ·
        1 year ago

        Democrats are also conservatives. If you allow the oligarchs and aristocrats to choose who represents you then they will always choose candidates who rule in their interest. You can’t change this system by playing within the ruleset you’re given. Democratic power can only ever be wielded by unions of workers and communes of citizens. Those organizations combine and concentrate the power of regular people and can effectively wield this against the ruling class.

        • Poggervania@kbin.social
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          8
          ·
          1 year ago

          It’s not even a matter of “Democrat vs Republican” - do you know what they all have in common? They’re all part of the same ruling class you mentioned, and they’re all also helping the corporate owners of America push their agendas.

          Like… it’s pretty damn blatant who the GOP are rooting for when you consider what rich asshats like Elongated Muskrat want, and then look at some of the policies they passed and go “oh shit.”

      • Rambi@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        13
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        The FPTP voting system means everyone is held hostage voting for the party they hate the least. If you vote for a third party you just make it more likely the party you hate most will win because the vote is split.

        Obviously things still wouldn’t be perfect with a proportional voting system but I think it would take some power away from capitalist oligarchs because we will be able to vote for a party we like without just making the fascists more likely to win. The issue is the only two parties you can realistically vote for are highly incentivised to not change the voting system because they will lose a lot of the power they have.

        • Rikudou_Sage@lemmings.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          4
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Or how about everyone who wants to vote 3rd party, votes 3rd party?

          I know it’s a little different because my country has proportional voting system, but the first two elections the party I vote for was below the limit to be in a parliament. I still voted for them as did others and now it’s one of the stronger parties.

          If everyone who doesn’t like both the parties starts voting 3rd party, you have a chance.

          • Rambi@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            ·
            1 year ago

            Think about it on the constituency level, say you have a constituency with 100,000 people. One year, 60k people vote for party A and 40k for party B so party A wins. But during during the years before the next election people become disenfranchised with party A so they start voting for party C who they like more. In the following election, party A gets 30k votes, party B gets 40k votes again and party C gets 30k votes. Because FPTP is a “winner takes all” system, party B is now takes that constituency which is the the party A and C voters dislike most, even though party B got less votes than those other two. This is called the spoiler effect. When this is happening all over a country, sure maybe some constituencies will flip but for each that does like 30 will have the vote split leading to a probable landslide victory for party B.

            Sure in your country, your vote was also “wasted” if your party of choice never entered parliament I suppose (although if you get to choose multiple parties in order of preference where it defaults to your second if the first doesn’t get enough votes then it isn’t wasted) but the ecosystem will be much more favourable to new parties growing because the way the voting system works makes it actually possible for them to do so. So the vote isn’t wasted like it is in FPTP.

            CGP Grey has some great videos about FPTP on his channel if you’re interested in a better explanation that I can provide.

      • drathvedro@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        Well, at least you’ve got a heads-up and some choice on how fast you get screwed.

        We just got a guy we didnt choose who just suddenly and royally f🇷🇺ks everyone over every few years or so

      • Rufus Q. Bodine III@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        The Dems can’t do anything without a majority. Give them a true majority where Sinema and Man Chin can’t hold things up. Then stand the fuck back.

        • mycatiskai@lemmy.one
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          8
          ·
          1 year ago

          Give the Democrats a 4 person majority then 5 conservative Democrats will Hum and Haw about fiscal responsibility to their voters.

          It is really up to hard progressives to get in and vote as a block to keep the Dems from passing watered down policy by forcing them to earn the blocks vote with real policies the public already want.

          Medicare for all, free college, 20 dollar minimum wage and more all all supported by way more than 50 percent of the country.

          The Dems want to lose these fights for their donors they need to be forced to do their job against their donors wishes.

      • fsxylo@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        19
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        Ohh that would almost be clever if it weren’t conservatives dragging the world through their unga bunga bullshit.

        • PostalDude@lemmy.basedcount.com
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          3
          arrow-down
          30
          ·
          1 year ago

          We started with hating the gays, then we accepted gays, now we hate straights. See, backwards. “Conservitves”, have been progressing in their own direction, which is not actually conservative but a branch of liberalism that focuses on things like anti abortion and more government control over that as well as border control and anti lgbt. One side of liberalism wants more government control over social things, the other wants government control over economic and state things. By things I mean…whatever those retards are bickering about ATM I’m not sure, thats just my own conclusion.

          • fsxylo@sh.itjust.works
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            23
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            No one cares about straight people enough to hate us. Spare me your fox news talking points about why we’re actually the most persecuted group in the universe. It’s old hat bullshit.

          • vivadanang@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            17
            ·
            1 year ago

            now we hate straights.

            who the fuck is we? why do you hate the straights? explain how this is progressive’s fault that you ‘hate the straights’

          • Poggervania@kbin.social
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            8
            ·
            1 year ago

            now we hate the straights

            No idea who hates straight people, but that line alone is telling me you need to touch grass.

            by things I mean… whatever those retards are bickering about ATM I’m not sure

            No, no, I’m fairly certain you do. Please elaborate on what things you’re talking about in this context.

          • mayo@lemmy.today
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            6
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            Some people think of politics as a circle instead of a spectrum, if that’s what you mean.

            From what I can tell gay people are getting a lot of hate sent their way lately. Didn’t someone just get shot and killed for having a pride flag.

      • shiveyarbles@beehaw.org
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        14
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        Progressive to me means fair wages, medicare for all, tackling climate change, defending civil rights, protecting against authoritarianism, tackling the wage gap, making government work for all people, etc.

        Conservative means insurrection, praising authoritarianism, banning books, attacking public education, idolizing the ultra wealthy, culture wars, gerrymandering, preventing fair elections, etc.

        I know what I prefer.