• Zoldyck@discuss.online
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    107
    arrow-down
    12
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Let’s do a little experiment:

    • Tankies are horrible
    • Nazi’s are horrible
    • The US is horrible
    • Russia is horrible
    • China is horrible
  • spez@sh.itjust.works
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    78
    arrow-down
    7
    ·
    1 year ago

    lemmy devs are actually pretty good at not forcing their ideology on others

    • Novman@feddit.it
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      27
      arrow-down
      4
      ·
      1 year ago

      It is way easier to get banned on reddit for a lot less than a slight not conformist opinion. Here they downvote you, stop. And i talk about real controversies.

      • Serinus@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        10
        arrow-down
        5
        ·
        1 year ago

        Uh huh. I’m already banned from some lemmygrad community. I don’t give enough of a shit to learn the name of it.

      • ShittyRedditWasBetter@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        15
        arrow-down
        22
        ·
        1 year ago

        100% disagree and add in the fact that everything here is a ninja ban with no explanation. This place is an echo chamber in places like fuck cars and the socialist subs. Privacy too. Was banned for what I can tell was pointing out that lemmy instances do not protect privacy at all.

        • vzq@lemmy.blahaj.zone
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          19
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          This place is an echo chamber in places like fuck cars and the socialist subs.

          The way I see it, there are subs/coms that are like fight club and subs that are like country clubs.

          If you get all argumentative and in peoples faces in a fight club, they be “no U” and argue back.

          But if people just want to chill out with their friends and you come over to start shit, you’ll get escorted out. And rightly so.

        • 𝒍𝒆𝒎𝒂𝒏𝒏@lemmy.one
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          10
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          This place is an echo chamber in places like fuck cars and the socialist subs

          What aspect of fuckcars do you consider an echo chamber?

          There’s over a dozen socialism communities, if you find one to be an ‘echo chamber’ then I’d suggest seeking another. I’d imagine the socialism community on Beehaw would have a completely different vibe to the one on Lemmygrad, as an example

          Was banned for what I can tell was pointing out that lemmy instances do not protect privacy at all

          This is common knowledge though, wouldn’t be surprised if the mods were sick of the same discussion being created over and over again by various users. Something federated - designed to be open, decentralised, unrestricted, cannot be inherently privacy friendly.

          If your privacy threat model brings you to an ideological disagreement with federated networks, it would be reasonable to consider moving to an alternative platform IMO.

          • ShittyRedditWasBetter@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            arrow-down
            7
            ·
            1 year ago

            No use for trucks, only Americans buy SUVs, you can’t find cars for under 20k etc. As for the mods, 🤷‍♂️ don’t ninja ban and maybe folks would understand.

        • Haui@discuss.tchncs.de
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          11
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          Glad to see you get your ass handed to yourself by others for a change. Has been a couple of days. How have you been?

      • Gork@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        7
        ·
        1 year ago

        Yeah but they haven’t built in communism… yet.

        I’d be ok though if it were the Fully Automated Luxury Gay Space Communism though.

    • icepuncher69@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Huh… im not sure about that, it hasnt happenned to me but i heard it happened to others and i bash tankies constantly.

  • silvercove@lemdro.id
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    91
    arrow-down
    25
    ·
    1 year ago

    I experience the opposite. Whenever I criticise US government, I get attacked by hordes of cringy Americans.

    • Disgusted_Tadpole@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      31
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      I must say I had a pleasant conversation on workers’ rights in the US recently on c/technology (lemmy.world). By pleasant I mean “not being insulted because I live in France and workers do have rights so I’m a red commie” pleasant.

    • kameecoding@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      20
      arrow-down
      22
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      is there any chance you are doing it while spouting Kremlin propaganda? because then there is maybe a time to look in the mirror on this one

      • silvercove@lemdro.id
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        15
        arrow-down
        23
        ·
        1 year ago

        Anyone that disagrees with the US government is spouting Kremlin propaganda. Riiiiight…

        You are a joke.

        • kameecoding@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          18
          arrow-down
          6
          ·
          1 year ago

          Anyone that disagrees with the US government is spouting Kremlin propaganda. Riiiiight…

          I mean, if you take what I said and completely change it, I can see why you might be upset at that. Though I would encourage you to reply to what I actually said.

          You are a joke.

          I am indeed a very funny guy, it’s a bit creepy that you know that though.

            • stingpie@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              6
              arrow-down
              4
              ·
              1 year ago

              goes on an anti-tankie post Comments that his posts are always dogpilled by the most anti-tankie group. Claims ad hominem when someone points it out.

              :)

              • silvercove@lemdro.id
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                4
                arrow-down
                3
                ·
                1 year ago

                Is it wrong to engage in a conversation with people we disagree with?

                Would you rather have us segregate based on our opinions?

            • kameecoding@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              2
              ·
              edit-2
              1 year ago

              I merely posited that you might be getting into arguments because you have drank the Kremlin propaganda, but from your posts I see it’s more that youblike to defend the Chinese government for some reason or at least like to do “a Whatabout the USA”

              also I am not sure you ubderstand what ad hominem is, it’s attacking the person saying it rather what the person is saying, if I were to say “you are spouting Kremlin propaganda” would be the exact opposite since I would be “attacking” what you are saying not who you are.

              hope that helps

              • silvercove@lemdro.id
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                2
                arrow-down
                2
                ·
                1 year ago

                A lot of americans and some other westerners always assume that anyone who disagrees with them must be infected with Russian/Chinese/(insert bogeyman) propaganda.

                Whereas the truth is that the Western civilization is on a murder spree and the rest of us who are not Westerners are disgusted by it.

        • SpooneyOdin@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          25
          arrow-down
          7
          ·
          1 year ago

          More than one thing can be wrong at the same time. The constant whataboutism is exhausting…

        • Solar Bear@slrpnk.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          4
          arrow-down
          3
          ·
          1 year ago

          Imagine thinking any large state isn’t constantly injecting propaganda into the Internet. Couldn’t be me.

            • Solar Bear@slrpnk.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              What I said was that people in the west are subjected to orders of magnitude of western propaganda, and perhaps should worry about that first.

              I’m capable of worrying about two things. Perhaps even three on a good day.

              Chomsky even pointed out recently that censorship in the west now is even worse than it was in USSR.

              Media being bad because capitalism pushes them to do evil to further their own ends is not the same thing as censorship enforced with state violence. These are both bad things, but uniquely bad in their own ways. I’m sad that Chomsky’s age has caught up to him and he can no longer distinguish the two.

                • Solar Bear@slrpnk.net
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  3
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  1 year ago

                  When people talk about censorship, they usually mean of media. Yes, I’m aware that the US government is an evil institution that targets activists and whistleblowers. You’ll never believe me, but I actually despise my government and nearly every person in it. However, authoritarian regimes also strike down those people, but additionally censor the media on top of it. So to say that state censorship is worse here and now is just asinine. There’s no need to make things up to seem worse than they are when they’re already very bad, it just leads to people swinging at ghosts.

    • Voli@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      15
      arrow-down
      21
      ·
      1 year ago

      Little do people know everyone is shit and your personality that is only based on ideologies makes you look like a moron. Yes we know there is unfairness in the world. But any “ism” won’t fix it.

      • SuddenDownpour@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        4
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        “Yes we know absolute monarchs, unequal access to justice, oppression and the dumb wars they get us into are unfair, but no ‘democracism’ will fix it”

        It takes a very basic knowledge of history to understand why this argument is shit.

  • LiberalSoCalist@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    44
    arrow-down
    4
    ·
    1 year ago

    1462 points 3 years ago

    reddit will delete this comment cuz they’re controlled by China but fuck the CCP!!!

    same energy

    • Fazoo@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      8
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      The CIA isn’t all that bad. It’s run by raccoons forming a shadow government.

    • h6a@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      The US controls gigantic parts of the information/entertainment space: movies, music, social networks, YouTube, TV, even their politics is a keyfabey circus for the rest of the world. American propaganda is literally everywhere.

      It’s an image of consumption and individualism above even self preservation, so deeply internalized that Americans and perhaps half of the rest of the world don’t notice. Sometimes it feels like the US lost its mind in 9/11 and started hurting itself in confusion but it was never a “smart player” in the world, just a narcissistic bully.

      It’s not necessary for the CIA to be involved because it’s literally superliminal and grotesque at this point in time. The US throws its weight all around the world and is brutish and callous with its “use of force”, which means murdering people (and destroying property, oh they love them some property) in case there’s people in this thread that are lost in so many layers of euphemisms and irony.

      Americans need to deal with this instead of becoming defensive and recurring to whataboutism. Yes, China and Russia are horrible and murderous in their own ways and at a different scale, but one must not use them to avoid self reflection.

  • Lucidlethargy@sh.itjust.works
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    39
    arrow-down
    21
    ·
    1 year ago

    I got banned from one of the communities for simply saying I thought both socialism and capitalism won’t work without more nuance and blending.

    I always figured the snowflakes were really the far right… But no, it’s both extremes, apparently.

      • Lucidlethargy@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        I honestly had no idea before I came to Lemmy.

        I actually really enjoy a lot of the facets of socialism and communism… Most people would easily mistake my independent political position as “left”, especially since I strongly oppose the current GOP.

        But here in Lemmygrad, I am apparently quite the villain for suggesting some extremist, far-left policies are toxic.

    • Sackbut@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      13
      arrow-down
      8
      ·
      1 year ago

      Socialism is just democracy extended into the workplace. Saying pure socialism won’t work is arguing against democracy.

      • Lucidlethargy@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        I will always argue against pure democracies. People are not invested enough to provide a coherent opinion on 100% of the solutions our societies require for survive and thrive.

        A vote over the use of chemicals for water treatment could easily end in their permanent ban. Hell, with the right malicious intent, someone could easily get dihydrogen monoxide banned from crop fields.

        A pure democracy is how Idiocracy becomes a reality. Now, a mix, such as a republic electing the careful use of democratic socialism… Sure!

        • Sackbut@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          That isn’t how it works. It’s like if you’re a part of a cooperatively run business, then you get equal say in workplace practices. There isn’t a ‘boss’ dictating the rules to you.

      • Aux@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        arrow-down
        16
        ·
        1 year ago

        Socialism is authoritarian. There’s no democracy in socialism.

        • Sackbut@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          16
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          The definition of socialism is workers owning the means of production. That means democracy in the workplace. Worker’s councils. Equal representation. Majoritarian politics.

      • zbyte64@lemmy.blahaj.zone
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        1 year ago

        I think people confuse “liberal society” with “liberal capitalism” and think if you have 100% socialism then you don’t even own a toothbrush or something

  • ShittyRedditWasBetter@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    24
    arrow-down
    11
    ·
    1 year ago

    I’ve been banned a few times specifically in fuck cars and then comrades I think? Absolutely some of the most fragile groups I know beside trumpets when it comes to accepting reality and facts.

          • icepuncher69@sh.itjust.works
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            24
            arrow-down
            4
            ·
            edit-2
            1 year ago

            Marxist or comunist or socialist are not the same as tankies, tankies are the insane ones that defend the Chinese government of all places and ussrs genocides among others. The comunist just like the ideology, i concider myself a socialist and even communist ina good day and still like to bash tankies due to them spewing out bullshit and defending tyranic/fasist regimes.

            • irmoz@reddthat.com
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              4
              arrow-down
              11
              ·
              1 year ago

              No, tankie is ML, if you want to be very specific, MLs that like the USSR.

              • cristo@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                Esperanto
                arrow-up
                5
                ·
                1 year ago

                I dont think you understand what tankie means, if you call yourself a tankie you might want to stop.

                • irmoz@reddthat.com
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  Why on Earth would I call myself a tankie lmao? I’m not a fan of the USSR, I think they did some bad things, many involving tanks

          • ArcticLynx@feddit.de
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            8
            arrow-down
            9
            ·
            1 year ago

            I’ve been watching a series on the fundamentals of Marxism-Leninism, and see none of that in the theory.

            in the theory

            of course no one includes genocide in their theory but if you try to apply communist theory to reality you’ll end up with it. so instead of looking at theories start looking at reality

            • irmoz@reddthat.com
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              11
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              edit-2
              1 year ago

              but if you try to apply communist theory to reality you’ll end up with genocide

              How? What do you know of the theory?

              If something is not part of communist theory, what sense does it make to call it a part of communism?

              And yes, genocidal ideologies do in fact have genocide in their theory. Just read anything written by Hitler or Mussolini.

              • ArcticLynx@feddit.de
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                3
                arrow-down
                6
                ·
                1 year ago

                every time it was tried communism failed eventually. it always caused oppression and in extreme cases even genocide. it doesn’t really matter what the theory looks like if that’s the reality

                • irmoz@reddthat.com
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  10
                  arrow-down
                  2
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  1 year ago

                  If your cake recipe asks for flour, sugar, milk and eggs, and you decide to use piss instead of milk, and shit instead of eggs, I’m not gonna buy it when people eat your cake and say cakes taste like shit and piss, though I will agree that your particular attempt did.

                  You also cannot possibly deny the role the US has played in every “failed” socialist project.

                • Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  2
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  They literally took the existing theory and re-wrote it into Marxism-Leninism and then a state applied the theory.

      • ArcticLynx@feddit.de
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        20
        arrow-down
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        the holodomor for example

        >the numbers are wrong

        >actually the kulaks are responsible

        >the ussr is being depicted as bad by western propaganda but it wasn’t that bad

        >you’re all brainwashed

        they sound just like holocaust deniers

      • Tyler_Zoro@ttrpg.network
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        12
        arrow-down
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        As someone who has worked extensively with the homeless, I’ve seen quite a few examples of where supposedly anti-homeless takes have been attempts to inject more nuance into discussions than simply being pro- or anti-homeless, both of which are practically meaningless positions.

    • learningduck@programming.dev
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      18
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      1 year ago

      Those who support authoritative regime. I think it’s the new commies. Tend to be used on those who are sympathetic to Russia and China.

    • Nacktmull@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      9
      ·
      1 year ago

      A nerd/geek who compulsively collects miniature model tanks, often obsessed especially with the famous Soviet medium tank known as T-34

    • mayo@lemmy.today
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      arrow-down
      7
      ·
      1 year ago

      I asked this question a little while ago because I’ve heard the term but it’s not always clear what it is referring to. I think that similarly to ‘woke’ it is used in the context of ideological or political battles, so the definition is variable depending on the context. Opponents will likely have the widest definition since that way they can insult the largest group of people whose beliefs they disagree with, eg. “If you support Ukraine you’re a tankie”.

      Words like ‘progressive’, ‘socialist’, ‘authoritarian’ are more appropriately descriptive if that’s what you’re going for. If you want to have an argument then ‘woke’, ‘tankie’, ‘SJW’, ‘karen/keith’, ‘snowflake’, ‘bootlicker’, ‘edgelord’, ‘redditor’ are good choices.

      • Rambi@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        The term originated in a British socialist political party, I can’t remember which, as a term for other socialists that supported the Soviet Union’s invasion of I think Hungary. The tank parts originates from the fact tanks were used. Like you say though, the term has become very watered down now and people kind of just throw it around without much discernment.