I’ll put the text I put under this same post months ago because I think it still applies:
I don’t think [they’re] a transphobe, but I also don’t think they understand the scale of the harassment trans people face on a daily basis. Like it’s so bad the users would rather just have potential trolls ignored and downvoted than to see well meaning cis people come in and do vigilante justice using the same tactics of abuse trans people go through every day.
That empathetic disconnect looks like transphobia to some users. I don’t know that the users are right, but I understand how you reached that conclusion, especially with [their] days-long [now months-long] soapbox crashout about how despotic Ada is.
Transphobia doesn’t have to be intentional to still be transphobia. It also doesn’t have to be intentional to hurt someone or cause harm indirectly. The fact that people think gatekeeping gender is okay or that xenogenders are “hurting real trans people” is already harmful in and of itself.
Pug and his associates were told this but they didn’t take the hint or look at themselves. They just decided that trans and queer people in the current day are too sensitive. And they kept going. So we really shouldn’t excuse them or say they weren’t being transphobic, they were. Whether or not they meant it going in.
It’s like if someone claimed to be an ally to those hurt by racism, said that “Well I don’t understand the idea of Chicanos and I don’t really see why I should respect them when one was rude to someone else months ago.”
And then other people go "Hey white dude, you’re showing your blind spots. You can do better.*
And then the white dude just goes “Why should I have to improve? I’m an anti-racist!”
PugJesus is a cis male who thinks because he uses she/her on a trans woman he’s an ally. He’s not when he’ll gladly toss aside things because someone was rude to someone else online.
Exactly. A person like that isn’t a real ally even if they call themselves one. They need to actually support people to be an ally, and that also means checking yourself when people call you out, not just saying that you’re an ally and don’t need to check yourself.
PugJesus was never an Ally honestly and the fact that him and his asshole friends decided to open up whining threads on !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com instead of checking themselves just goes to show that.
You can be declare yourself to be an ally, or anti-“bad thing”. The people of those groups decide, not you.
“I’m a stamp collector, I just own zero stamps, I don’t listen to anyone who says I should collect stamps, and I say everyone who calls me a false stamp collector is actually hurting the stamp collecting community.”
Check the mod and post history of everyone saying Blahaj is a dictatorship or is supporting attack helicopter shit. Every one gatekeeps or says horrid shit.
Meanwhile I’ve never been called transphobic. Or racist. Or sexist. Because I don’t go “I’m actually I’m a true ally you stupid idiot, listen to the guy who isn’t part of your group and obey my orders or you’re the true bigot!”
Fuck I typed it wrong. That’s embarassing, this is why we need that stupid auto markdown thing removed because I can’t use it or it links the community wrong and I have to type it out manually to avoid it being a hard link to the original version
@dessalines@lemmy.ml@nutomic@lemmy.ml Please make the autocorrect for communities stop filling in a Markdown link like this [!lemmy@lemmy.ml](https://lemmy.ml/c/lemmy) and just have it autocorrect to the correct annotation like this !lemmy@lemmy.ml. We don’t need it to insert Markdown links like that anymore because the software does it automatically.
I don’t know if I or someone else already made an issue for it but I think it’s also good to show it causing problems on the field too.
Which is weird because Ada is pretty hands-off… The way she handled the 196 move to oneninetysix was pretty masterlcass in “hands-off” approach, imho.
I still don’t understand what’s so hard about just not engaging with those you suspect of trolling with neopronouns.
The one time I accidentally interacted with Drag it wasn’t hard to respect drags pronouns. Also, I have personally never seen evidence that drag is actually trolling. Drag seems like a normal Lemmy user.
Yeah like I’m open to being shown evidence that drag was/is trolling, there are definitely people out there who would do that. But out of quite a few posts I haven’t really seen any, and I figured someone would have linked some in the big flame threads sometime.
The thing is though it doesn’t have to be intentional hate to be transphobia. Someone can mean well and still be transphobic. They can believe that trans people deserve to have their rights respected and still be transphobic. And really pretty much anything which “us[es] the same tactics of abuse” almost certainly crosses that line.
If PugJesus could look in a mirror, he’d be very upset!
I’ll put the text I put under this same post months ago because I think it still applies:
Transphobia doesn’t have to be intentional to still be transphobia. It also doesn’t have to be intentional to hurt someone or cause harm indirectly. The fact that people think gatekeeping gender is okay or that xenogenders are “hurting real trans people” is already harmful in and of itself.
Pug and his associates were told this but they didn’t take the hint or look at themselves. They just decided that trans and queer people in the current day are too sensitive. And they kept going. So we really shouldn’t excuse them or say they weren’t being transphobic, they were. Whether or not they meant it going in.
It’s like if someone claimed to be an ally to those hurt by racism, said that “Well I don’t understand the idea of Chicanos and I don’t really see why I should respect them when one was rude to someone else months ago.”
And then other people go "Hey white dude, you’re showing your blind spots. You can do better.*
And then the white dude just goes “Why should I have to improve? I’m an anti-racist!”
PugJesus is a cis male who thinks because he uses she/her on a trans woman he’s an ally. He’s not when he’ll gladly toss aside things because someone was rude to someone else online.
Exactly. A person like that isn’t a real ally even if they call themselves one. They need to actually support people to be an ally, and that also means checking yourself when people call you out, not just saying that you’re an ally and don’t need to check yourself.
PugJesus was never an Ally honestly and the fact that him and his asshole friends decided to open up whining threads on !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com instead of checking themselves just goes to show that.
Exactly.
You can be declare yourself to be an ally, or anti-“bad thing”. The people of those groups decide, not you.
“I’m a stamp collector, I just own zero stamps, I don’t listen to anyone who says I should collect stamps, and I say everyone who calls me a false stamp collector is actually hurting the stamp collecting community.”
Check the mod and post history of everyone saying Blahaj is a dictatorship or is supporting attack helicopter shit. Every one gatekeeps or says horrid shit.
Meanwhile I’ve never been called transphobic. Or racist. Or sexist. Because I don’t go “I’m actually I’m a true ally you stupid idiot, listen to the guy who isn’t part of your group and obey my orders or you’re the true bigot!”
Yeah most of them have atrocious moderation history and equally nasty comment history.
Like certain members who claim blahaj is a dictatorship where you can’t descent.
Pretty sure its !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com, not on blahaj.
Fuck I typed it wrong. That’s embarassing, this is why we need that stupid auto markdown thing removed because I can’t use it or it links the community wrong and I have to type it out manually to avoid it being a hard link to the original version
@dessalines@lemmy.ml @nutomic@lemmy.ml Please make the autocorrect for communities stop filling in a Markdown link like this
[!lemmy@lemmy.ml](https://lemmy.ml/c/lemmy)and just have it autocorrect to the correct annotation like this !lemmy@lemmy.ml. We don’t need it to insert Markdown links like that anymore because the software does it automatically. I don’t know if I or someone else already made an issue for it but I think it’s also good to show it causing problems on the field too.Oh shit, i did the same thing.
This is absolutely fair and I have no pushback on your position at all. Thank you for your personal insight. :)
Which is weird because Ada is pretty hands-off… The way she handled the 196 move to oneninetysix was pretty masterlcass in “hands-off” approach, imho.
I still don’t understand what’s so hard about just not engaging with those you suspect of trolling with neopronouns.
The one time I accidentally interacted with Drag it wasn’t hard to respect drags pronouns. Also, I have personally never seen evidence that drag is actually trolling. Drag seems like a normal Lemmy user.
Yeah like I’m open to being shown evidence that drag was/is trolling, there are definitely people out there who would do that. But out of quite a few posts I haven’t really seen any, and I figured someone would have linked some in the big flame threads sometime.
The thing is though it doesn’t have to be intentional hate to be transphobia. Someone can mean well and still be transphobic. They can believe that trans people deserve to have their rights respected and still be transphobic. And really pretty much anything which “us[es] the same tactics of abuse” almost certainly crosses that line.