I’ve been using Linux exclusively for about 8 years. Recently I got frustrated with a bunch of issues that popped one after another. I had a spare SSD so I decided to check out Windows again. I’ve installed Windows 11 LTSC. It was a nightmare. After all the years on Linux, I forgot how terrible Windows actually is.
On the day I installed the system and a bunch of basic software, I had two bluescreens. I wasn’t even doing anything at that time, just going through basic settings and software installation. Okay, it happens. So I installed Steam and tried to play a game I’ve been currently playing on Linux just to see the performance difference. And it was… worse, for some reason. The “autodetect” in game changed my settings from Ultra to High. On Linux, the game was running at the 75 fps cap all the time. Windows kept dropping them to around 67-ish a lot of times. But the weirdest part was actual power consumption and the way GPU worked. Both systems kept the GPU temperature at around 50C. But the fans were running at 100% speed at that temperature on Windows, while Linux kept them pretty quiet. I had to change the fan controls by myself on Windows just because it was so annoying. The power consumption difference was even harder to explain, as I was getting 190-210W under Linux and under Windows I got 220-250W. And mind you, under Linux I had not only higher graphical settings set up, but was also getting better performance.
I tried connecting my bluetooth earbuds to my PC. Alright, the setup itself was fine. But then the problems started. My earbuds support opus codec for audio. Do you think I can change the bluetooth codec easily, just like on Linux? Nope. There is no way to do it without some third party programs. And don’t even get me started on Windows randomly changing my default audio output and trying to play sound through my controller.
Today I decided to make this rant-post after yet another game crashed on me twice under Windows. I bought Watch Dogs since it’s currently really cheap on Steam. I click play. I get the loading screen. The game crashed. I try again. I play through the basic “tutorial”. After going out of the building, game crashed again. I’m going to play again, this time under Linux.
I’ve had my share of frustrations under Linux, but that experience made me realise that Windows is not a perfect solution either. Spending a lot of time with Linux and it’s bugs made me forget all the bad experience in the past with Windows, and I was craving to go back to the “just works” solution. But it’s not “just works”. Two days was all it took for me to realize that I’ll actually stick with Linux, probably forever. The spare SSD went back to my drawer, maybe so I can try something new in the future. It’s so good to be back after a short trip to the other side!
What Linux distro are you using share Bluetooth and audio “just works”?
Probably the DE more than the distro, for me Bluetooth has “just worked” under KDE
fresh install of windows 10 i have to turn my monitor on and off twice to get anything to display on my screens
Welcome back to sanity
Using Windows since Windows XP was sired. Using Linux for longer than that, mostly Linux servers, but have tons of years of Linux Desktop experience under my belt, with probably half of all Linux distributions on DistroWatch.com.
Conclusion: Linux server rocks. Windows Desktop sux in many ways, but it just works and I personally have no issues with it. Linux Desktop is the worst hell possible. Barely ever works. It is literal hell and I hate it.
Whenever I try to get into Linux Desktop, I have to meditate and drink a de-stressing tea beforehand, or else I cannot guarantee the laptop’s or PC’s screen’s safety, when dealing with Linux Desktop.
For anyone attempting to comment: note, that there is a huge difference between headless server Linux usage and Linux Desktop/GUI usage. I’m only talking about Linux GUI. Linux headless is fine and works great!
But did you try (the distro I personally prefer)? I’ve tried 500 distros and that one is the one that actually worked for me.
I’d summarize the current OS situation as
Windows Just Works until it doesn’t, at which point there’s basically nothing you can do about it and you just have to kick it until something clicks into place and it starts working properly again.
Whereas linux Just Works to a slightly smaller degree, but when it stops Just Working it does so in granular steps most of the time, and every part of the ecosystem tries to help you fix things when they break.
Windows is a resin-potted black box that takes input and does stuff, if it breaks you’re supposed to just chuck it and buy a new one.
Linux is a slightly bulkier thing that you can just unscrew and replace a capacitor when it breaks.Only if you refuse to put forth the same effort into fixing windows as you do with Linux. Not wanting to learn doesn’t mean it’s not learnable.
Have a different experience. Usually, Linux does not even boot, due to driver issues, in the first place. So, the first installation process usually easily takes 5 to 10 hours, straight. And this is only for common popular distributions, not to mention lesser known and lesser supported ones. (Talking about Linux GUI based installations, only.)
yeah no i’m sorry but this just sounds completely fucking made up
Oh I just did that
What do you need as proof? All I have to do, is getting a random laptop, doesn’t matter which one and I will make a video for you. Is that enough?
Over the past 5 years, I’ve installed ubuntu about 30 times on different computers. Not once has an install on an SSD taken me more than an hour, with it typically taking me 30 minutes or less except for rare occasions where I’ve messed something up.
It’s not about the speed of the installation… It’s about the installation not working. Crashes. Hard to see error logs. Drivers missing for the most generic hardware, ever. No, I’m not talking about an unmaintained fringe distribution. I’m talking about Ubuntu, Lubuntu & Debian. Plain old stable and simple.
I almost never had Linux not boot after a fresh install, even with nVidia hardware. It happened a few times like 10 years ago and never again. What hardware are you running?
If you’re willing to put up with the low security options provided by default and don’t have a weird laptop, maybe.
Happened to me all the time, when, for example, setting up very generic and common laptops for family & friends. It never worked out of the box. Every single time, I had to give special treatment. Research extra drivers, etc… Hard to do in some locations, when they do not have a second system to do all the work from.
Laptops have historically been a little iffy yeah. Personally I haven’t had many issues except for Nvidia optimus, but since most of them are non standard and proprietary it used to be kind of a pain. Now though it’s much better, at least on newer hardware, even my newest laptop with hybrid graphics just worked out of the box.
Lol “the main computer market is iffy”
Tried it over many years. Last one was last year. Every time, the same problem. I even considered moving to Windows, but it would be tougher for me to administrate for me, as I’m used to headless Linux. It’s just, whenever Linux tries to GUI, it fucks up everything colossaly.
I just don’t see it. I run it on all my PCs with nvidia, amd, hybrid graphics, pretty much any combination (I have too many 😅). It works. Even various friends of mine have tried it on their older setups, no problems there either.
Unless you’re using something like Debian or whatever with crazy old packages, everything works for the most part. Nvidia is still not great on Wayland but it at least works now.
I’m not saying your experience isn’t valid, I’m not trying to gaslight you, but I’m not sure it’s representative of the average experience nowadays.
What PCs? Certified by some Linux supporting company? If you buy a random laptop or pre-made PC, chances are high, that it won’t work. And I’m not even a “beginner”, who does “beginner” mistakes. No, I’m actually a Linux pro. I work with Linux literally every single day, even in my free time.
I think it highly depends on what kind of hardware you are attempting to install Linux on. You can make it work on almost anything, but the graphical installers are best used with hardware that was widely used when the distribution was released.
Also the older and more obscure distros may not have installers that pass secure boot checks, which is very frustrating if you don’t know what is happening.
I can’t relate to this at all.
We use windows machines as software developers at work and really have no issues at all. Never had a bluescreen in these two years.
I use windows at home to play Factorio, Minecraft, and RDR2. Again, never had an issue. No blue screens. I turn it on open steam and play my games then turn it off when done.
I tried Linux again cause I got sucked in by this echo chamber and that did not go well at all. I explicitly said I don’t want to have to be a nerd in my free time to manage Linux which I was assured isn’t the case. Then one day I turn it on and have no sound and no idea why it just died. I swiftly removed Linux and went back to windows.
I do use Linux for servers for Jellyfin and stuff and I like it for those things, but me personally have had a better experience using windows and I can’t understand all these people against it.
Was windows dev for 10 years, I switched to Linux for work and I’m never going back : everything is simpler (may not be easier though) and makes sense whereas you constantly work against the system in windows. It’s an opinion so widespread they even made a subsystem to use Linux tools on windows. As a user windows installation is an utter nightmare, getting rid of the thousands stuff you don’t want is horrible. And also you may not even be able to install it without special ssd drivers that you have to side load manually (for some pretty basic asus hardware) Also don’t get me started on the nearly mandatory microsoft account 🤢
You don’t have to get rid of all the stuff, it doesn’t break the system like missing sounds or whatnot. Some of its even helpful like weather and news. Plus it isn’t that hard to make a Microsoft account, don’t you need one anyway for Minecraft? And since when do you need drivers for an SSD, don’t those usually work out of the box?
I just installed Linux Mint yesterday. Can’t wait to get home to continue playing around with it. I like it so far!
Yea, I have to use windows at work presently and I hate every second of fighting with it.
Windows doesn’t even have a fully functional implementation of focusing windows on hover, a common feature of any Linux system WM I have ever used. There is a setting to do this in Windows accessibility settings, and it’s true, it DOES change focus on hover; but it DOESN’T change the functionality of foreground windows getting pushed behind those windows, making it pretty much pointless, and actually more annoying to use.
Also just the performance is such shit, probably because it’s now designed to be doing hundreds of unnecessary telemetry tasks at all time on the back end. Also what the fuck is with every piece of Windows software configuring itself to run on boot or as a service? So incredibly annoying.
As somebody who works in IT at a Windows-only environment, I know exactly what you mean.
I have to fight with Windows on a weekly basis. Driver issues, firmware issues, software crashes/lockups, performance issues, etc etc.
Just this week, I have two users experiencing issues with their monitors. Identical enterprise grade laptops, identical drivers, identical docking stations, all totally up to date on Windows 11. Their old Windows 10 computers worked fine. Still trying to figure out what’s wrong.
Yep. The difference is simply put just ppl are used to the quirks on Windows but not on Linux.
How to install an application on Windows
- You hear about some application
- You google the application name
- You get a bunch of links
- You click the first one (and hope it’s valid and not hijacked by malware ads)
- You scan the webpage to find the correct download button (and hope it’s not an ad link)
- Download the application
- Double-click the application.exe
- Windows UAC pops up which you have to allow
- Install start and you click next, next, next (You hope the installer does not change your homepage or install some browser toolbar)
- Installation finished
Windows is so much easier /s
How to install the app on Linux.
You search for it. Highly likely it is not available or barely functional.
IF it works, it’s only packaged for Ubuntu, Debian and Arch. If you use Nix or something even more niche, good luck with proprietary software or sometimes even openly available open source software.
Or, you DO find it, but it’s glitchy/outdated (I think there was an issue with Steam). Or you search for the program, find the website, download a .tar.gz, wonder what the hell is this double extension abomination, double click it, doesn’t work, look it up, apparently it’s a type of container like a zip and not a basic program like an exe and instead of using the GUI like a normal person you have to type “tar -xcv” or something that might as well be black magic (I can’t even remember the correct letters), then to actually install you have to find the magic “make” “sudo make install” command, and it still fails.
Much easier to double click the .exe, accept the license agreement, and hit continue a few times.
Most of the time, the package is available on the standard package manager which makes the process extremely simple. Hardest part is knowing the package name. If you know
apt search, you don’t even have to search on the browser to find the package name. But certain packages are only available as tar.gz or as source. But those are usually not encountered by newbies.If someone is using Nix, they generally don’t have trouble finding packages. Also, Nix has more packages compared to AUR.
apt searchis very inefficient. It outputs way too many results and at least 8/10 times, I search for a keyword related to the package, which is not in the package name or description itself, so the package does not show up for me.Searching online is better, but still crap. I work a lot with Container Images, Alpine etc. professionally and in my free time. Searching for the right Alpine package is always a huge pain in the ass.
Less is more. Nix has lots of packages, but they are barely maintained. For fun, I set up a Kubernetes cluster on NixOS a couple of years back. Had it “running” until last month. Long story short: Kubernetes is broken on NixOS. There are several open GitHub issues since years and nobody fixes them, because not enough people care to fix Kubernetes for NixOS.
I think you were being biased.
- You heard the name of the software
- You search on Google, which takes you to their official website
- You click on the download button and download it
- Double click on the file and follow the on-screen guide to finished the installation
To your conscious brain, it might seem like 4 steps. But we are doing a lot more in reality because install process is second nature to us (Because of several years of usage).
If you tell someone who has never used a Windows PC to install a software and my list is more accurate.
- Forgot scan app with virus total
- Investigate if hits are false positives
- Get frustrated and run exe any way
Tbf, winget is a god sent and works surprisingly well, took them what? 30 years to get it done?!
winget is everything which Windows fanboys are against. Don’t get me wrong, it’s fantastic (terminals ftw). However, I remember people often smirked about the fact that in Linux you have to type commands to install something and the GUI method is much superior.
Exactly. It took me 4 hours a couple months ago to get a scanner to work on our Windows 11 PC. It turns out there was some Windows Image Acquisition service built in that had to be disabled because it was conflicting with the driver of the scanner. Absolute insanity lmao
I told one of my friends about this since my friends sometimes tease me about using Linux, their response was get a better scanner.
lol
Just today I logged into a Workstation at work, just to see 2 versions of Teams being auto launched. And no, no one installed 2 Versions, it was Windows.
Literally the same story happened on Linux in the span of decades countless times. On Windows? Cannot remember this happening more than once.
Yeah when I see people say that gaming on Linux “isn’t there yet” I have to wonder how long it’s been since they’ve tried. And people who install Windows on their Steam Deck? Don’t get it.
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Bluetooth is so bad on Windows. You cannot simply “reconnect” a headset
You have to unpair and pair each time you want to use it.
This was with Intel Bluetooth too which works extremely well, under Linux and Macos.
If anyone wants a great terminal bluetooth manager, use blutuith (https://github.com/darkhz/bluetuith)
My friend uses the same headset on Linux, that I use on Windows.
When he “mutes” his headset, it is not actually muted on Linux. It is not really fixable. Obviously, on Windows it just works.
What? That’s just not true. If I turn on my Bluetooth earbuds they reconnect to my laptop right away as that’s the last thing they were paired to
Curious what Bluetooth chip you have as this was my experience and the several devices and a couple different windows machines
Windows Bluetooth paired my Google Pixel Buds Pro once and refused to unpair or delete them no matter what I tried, but would happily connect to them every time I booted the system. I had to literally wipe the install clean and start fresh before it was ever fixed. And those same earbuds worked everywhere else, even my fucking gaming laptop with a MediaTek wireless card running Arch. genuinely the worst experience I’ve had with Bluetooth so far.
Yep exactly my experience with several Bluetooth headphones.
Fine on my Android as well.
Windows just seems to always struggle with Bluetooth and printers.
I’m no great fan of windows, but I have no issues reconnecting to bluetooth things. Kinda the opposite really, my phone and windows keep wanting to compete for who gets to be connected to my headset as soon as I turn it on, I have to make sure to turn off bluetooth when I’m done with it. I think the problem may be on your end in this case.
I will say I had a lot of trouble with Bluetooth (bluez) on Linux, but I think it mainly comes down to the implementation. I have a cheap dongle and pairing gamepads has been a nightmare sometimes.
I had to transfer files over Bluetooth to a Windows PC. Fuck that is terrible compared to doing it on my Linux PC.
Oh yeah I just use magic wormhole now for file transfer it’s much more reliable
The problem with Windows is that it is not build to be parametrised. Anyone a bit tech-savy will be frustrated by the inability to tune it effectively for their need.
The problem with Linux is that it is not tech-normie friendly. Sure it has distribution easy to use and pre-parametrised so anyone with basic computer skill can use it. But people with basic computer skill don’t have computers with Linux. Anyone who just want to use a computer has to first learn how to install an OS.Good points.
The problem with Linux is that it is not tech-normie friendly.
That probably was true 15 years ago. That is absolutely not true now. This misconception stems from the fact that most tech normies have a lot of experience with Windows through job, so people assume Windows is friendly, but in reality they just know how it works.
Learning how to use Linux is dead easy. It’s not popular because it’s not pre installed, as you said, but it’s not because the OS is bad, it’s because Linux doesn’t have multibillion corporation behind it to make sure its everywhere.I tend to disagree, I do have several devices running Linux and with all of them I had issues after install (standby not working, swap partition not recognized, sound only playing on half of the speakers, issues with monitor scaling etc…) Im fine with it and like the journey, but there are still quirks.
Probably Im in an in-between-world where I do have some tricky use-cases, but missing the full know-how to do it…
thing which makes it not normy-usable, are the documentations: for windows issues you can find DAU-conform guides to solve something. Mostly on “official” (with probably too many ads) pages.
For Linux it’s usually a rabbit hole of official documentations (which dont show all the options), forums, reddit pages, where some guy tells another guy to add xyz to the config file…without telling which file and where in the file. Why is this command not listed in the documentation? What does that command actually do?
It has gotten much better, but there’s still some way to go
[…] in reality they just know how it works
In my experience, they know how a few utilities and how a handful of programs work, but have no idea how Windows works. Not that many people actually know how Windows works.
Roughly figuring out the boot sequence of Linux is relatively easy once you’ve used it for a year or two. What happens when Windows boots? Who knows? kernel32 probably is involved at some point.Linux/Unix is actually relatively simple and logical once you’ve figured it out. Windows is a messy dark maze with grues waiting at every corner to eat you.
They don’t know how it works, but they roughly kind of know how to operate it. And they mistake their years of experience for the intuitivness.
It’s a WIMP system. They all work the same way. Worst case you have to click around a bit.
You should have the end of my comment with more attention. That’s not my point you counter here.
Third party licensed apps are everything on Windows.
I think Windows is successful because it creates a nice Enterprise environment, where companies can easily get into investing into new apps to use in their offices. I think that’s why it’s successful.
part that, and part just that windows is successful because it’s successful. Everyone learns windows, thus everyone uses windows, thus everyone teaches windows.
It’s like how all life on earth produces and consumes a specific form of sugar, but when you make sugar in a lab you get both forms, and the second form is completely inert to all digestive systems on earth.
